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Give me a no nonsense person of foresight and action (FDR, Churchill, Lincoln, etc) over a ponderer who can never come to a conclusion anytime.
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But foresight means being prudent and thinking things through first.
Looking back on major political leaders, especially during times of war, it's easy to perceive them as someone who didn't sit around and think about decisions. You can learn pretty much everything essential about their Presidency/Prime Minister term in a few dedicated hours. This doesn't mean they didn't hesitate and think. Bare bones history courses and documentaries don't, and often couldn't if they wanted, account for the hours or days of deliberation. -
You miss the point. Of course a man of action must ponder and plan before acting, but philosophers, by and large, only ponder. Without action, what is their value?
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Ghandi was a ponderer and not really a man of action
i would say plenty but none of which you will know because the thinkers often dont win the wars
o wait
-hitler
-lenin
-diefenbaker(lol.. o, many wont get this)
or all them cultural leaders
-robbie burns etc.
-artists, poets, all of which i like much better than arrogant soliciting doer's
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What is their value?
To ponder for the decision makers maybe. -
i agree with apple. Most decision makers dont ponder enough and often turn to the ponderers for advice.
everybody needs their enabler -
also, a ponderer may say something of interest that helps the action makers do the right thing.
in the end, we all rely on each other. -
Famous philosophers, remembered solely as philosophers rather than leaders, ALSO aren't shown in history for the other sides of their life. Depending on the philosopher, I'm sure many were occasionally impulsive and men of action. But on something not historically major, because they were in no role to do such.
Most of the memorable forefathers of the country were very much philosophers. -
damn forefathers!
.....i'm a loyalist -
Everyone is a philosopher, its what determines those things we vallue in life and are willing to strive for, the question then becomes ,who is a good philosopher, or what is a good philosophy for me, the person that I am, and even that becomes a circle , because in order to make that determination, we must first have a philosophy
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It's hard to explain. Our philosophy is each person's opinion, motto, his/her American flag. Differences in opinion are what make society so diverse. Take Weydon vs. Orange seedsandpeel for instance.
Weydon says: "Most of the memorable forefathers of the country were very much philosophers."
Orange says: "I'm a loyalist."
What if Orange said "I agree"?
If you ask me, that isn't very interesting... -
Philosopher?
What is a Philosopher? A man who thinks. But that is where I find the term Philosopher funny, because we now put labels on people who think... we all think... everyone thinks... but one becomes a great thinker when he questions. -
Similar to any religious and political leaders, the “good” in philosophers lies in their ability to provide man with a sense of significance or purpose. They’re much like “fluffers” in porn because they are there to keep Man’s sense of pride erect.
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a good philosopher is someone who has an open mind. and can reason with oneself. many philosophers don't take action. but that is because no one will listen. it's as if people now-a-days are "scared" of the truth or they just plainly don't want to hear a reasonable explanation for things. the people that do take action often do turn to the "thinkers". and it is crazy to say that philosophers are useless because hitler and all these other insane people who have managed genocide and made their country turn into nothing but poverty. obviously had something on their mind but it wasn't very reasonable or decent.
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Aristotle had considerable practical influence as he was for quite a few years an advisor to Alexander the Great. Seneca served as Nero's chief adviser for many years; Marcus Aurelius was Emperor of Rome; some of the mediaeval scholastics had important roles in both church and state; Bacon was a very important politician; Descartes served as adviser to the Queen of Sweden; Locke helped to overthrow James II in England as well as inspiring the Founding Fathers of the USA; Voltaire and Rousseau were inspirers of the French Revolution; Marx and Engels of Communism; Bolingbroke's ideas were among the earliest examples of 'welfare state' thinking; Bentham and John Stuart Mill managed to get changes in the laws; Arthur Balfour became Prime Minister; Gentile was an adviser to Mussolini and wrote the Fascist Party programme; Ayn Rand inspired a whole generation of minarchist activists.
I could certainly find other examples but that's a long enough list already to totally refute the claim that philosophers do NOT have the ability to act outside the mental sphere of things!
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Adding your reply:
mudgod
Jun 5 1:51 PM 2007
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