There are 24 choices, 32 votes for ennoia's debate

How do we know religion isn't just brainwashing?

Millions have a religious faith.

But WHY?

Are there actually any *logical* reasons?

(please, no appeals to "you're not a christian, so you don't understand God!" - which is neither philosophy or very sensible if you're supporting the anti-brainwash side...)


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  • Nothing can be true without questioning

    I wonder if anyone has read Aesop's fable, the Man and the Wooden God? (The one that got him chucked over a cliff by some angry preists!)

    I don't want that to be the main body of my argument, although it presents a starkly simple point.

    How do we KNOW that religion isn't just brainwashing? WHY (on what grounds) should we believe the Bible or the Qur'an, and their teachings?

    (I'm only choosing Christianity and Islam because they relate rather nicely, but I suppose it could apply to many religons)

    As soon as anyone tries to reason why we should believe the Bible, or indeed the Qur'an, doesn't it come down to;

    "Because God said so!"

    And where did he say so?

    "In the Bible."

    Can any religious text make claims that are not self-justifying, and if not, doesn't this mean the Bible is just as truthful as the next Occult book?

    If people are brought up in a particular religion, is it anything other than brainwashing if they then never question WHY they hold that particular faith?

    It's interesting to apriciate that Buddhism appeals far more to philosophy on grounding it's claims, than most other religions, and encourages you to think exactly why you should accept views. If Christianity never does this, is it not spirituality at all, rather just brainwashing?

    15%  Voted for by Drabarno Ruv, RenewedSoul818, ennoia, TheDarknessVisible, WolfStar or Ash.
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  • Religion is important

    Religion is important for a logical reason. It gives hope to the otherwise hopeless, faith to the otherwise faithless, and infuses thought into the otherwise thoughtless. We, those with Internet, are considered lucky to have all that we have now. Vaccinations, doctors, food, shelter, clothing, etc. We are not usually in immediate need or want of any of the above, because we are so well-provided for. But think about those who aren't provided for. Or think of a time when we weren't so lucky.

    Think of the Middle Ages when one out of three people were going to die of the Black Death and you had no way of protecting yourself. Food's scarce, there's no dependable medicine, and government's pretty much been shot to hell. You've got nothing to believe in but in the idea that maybe something out there is going to either save you in this life or something is going to recieve you in the next life. Religion is a way of filling out the uncertainty in a life filled with turmoil. It'll give those who are unstable and neglected a means of feeling like they belong. It will give those without hope some hope for a better future after life. It'll explain things that people can't come up with answers for.

    Religion is a safety blanket that works best in times of great desperation. When humans have nothing to hold onto, they hold onto religion. Families convert to a religion because they don't have any other stable factor in their lives. If you're a slave in the Roman empire and you're presented to some emperor worshipping religion along with the belief that you OUGHT to be a slave compared to a religion that says that you're all equal in its god's eyes, then what are you going to choose? That which presents you the most hope. Children also tend to believe in what their families believe in. If your parents are Republicans, chances are, you will be a Republican. If your parents believe in abortion, chances are, you will probably believe in abortion. That is the same thing with religion. The religion keeps going down the bloodlines even if we don't need the hope that it offers anymore because it is passed from generation to generation.

    But religion is important also because it gives us a moral template. For intelligent people, we can more or less deduce what is good moral behaviour, but for less intelligent people, someone has to teach them not to steal, not to commit adultery, not to kill. Something needs to stand as a moral authority, and religion is usually what does it.

    So religion is important in the times that it is needed, but it is also important to maintain the morality of a society even if that society is no longer in danger of hopelessness. Even atheists hold Judeo-Christian ethics. Don't commit adultery (before Judeo-Christian rules, pagans committed adultery all the time without consequence). Love your neighbor (Romans believed that loving your neighbor or charity was a state duty but not a personal one). Without these religious codes, we would fall apart as a society, because without some sort of ethic to hold us together we'd fall into chaos. We needed religion to spark that first creed that regulated our actions.

    But we are only brainwashed when we cease to think about what we believe in. You can be Christian and totally competent, because you think about what you're taught and you choose to be Christian. You become brainwashed when you no longer are Christian or religious by act of the reaffirmation of your own will. You simply are because you're told to be.

    But religion does not equal brainwashing.

    12%  Voted for by holloweyed, emilian, Ostara, aria94.
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  • propaganda

    I studied propaganda in year 10 at a christain school, Looking at all the sides and methods used in Propaganda. they all are involved in the christain religon.

    Appeal to fear: The idea of "Eternal damnnation.

    Appeal to authority: Politians whom use "god bless, and refrences to a higher power.

    Argumentum ad nauseam: The use of God,Jesus holy spirit in every pray and blessing.

    Inevitable victory: Believe in God, and go to heaven.

    Intentional vagueness: which is why there are so many questions posted on the reasons behind religion.

    Common man:God loves everyone no matter what.

    Testimonial: Speaks for itself.

    Couple of examples, so even if the origins of religion were nowhere near these concepts, the Christain religion of today is going along these things, intentionally or not.

    9%  Voted for by ennoia, strawberry gashes, aria94.
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  • Religion is brainwashing

    Religion is organised and of coarse you are there to believe what they believe. Do you know the difference between religion and spirituality?

    Everyone has a belief system, religion is an organised group where you are able to find connections to the ones who believe the same as you, as for spirituality which is more individual and not organised.

    Churches, bible study's..the works, all organised religion.

    6%  Voted for by Exo, ExpensiveThinker.
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  • It isn't JUST Brainwashing,

    It is a CRIME against innocent minds that cannot fight back beliefs befallen on them from ignorant parents. Religion is a cult. Once you are in it, you can almost never escape. Mankind is also a cult. Americans believe that you should die for a flag. Politicians have been manipulating "patriots" for centuries to fight for their per$onal causes. Once you know the truth that the only true relgion is belief in oneself and the only church is your body, life attains TRUE meaning.

    6%  Voted for by david13, Socio-Sympathy.
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  • Religion is one of the biggest conspiracies

    I was raised as a very strict apostolic. For those of you who do not know what that is, the women cannot wear pants or shorts, always skirts, they cannot cut their hair but have to keep it up in a bun, no makeup, no jewelry, etc. I would go to church at a very young age and see these people that god was supposedly talking through, and it really scared the hell out of me. I would go home and put on pants and wuld be scared to death that someone from my church would see me and tell on me and I would be condemed or something, it's pretty sad. When I got old enough to make my own choices I did the one thing that my grandma thought was the devil, I got deep into withcraft. Anyways.. to make a long story short, I grew up and started to question religion. Think about it like this, some guy wrote the bible and then all of these different people came and tried to make different interpratations out of it and came up with their own religion. It's just another way to control people. I do not understand how the red letter version of the bible is supposed to be word for word, how is that possible. I am now agnostic. I believe in somehting, I call it karma, that is the only thing that makes any sence to me at all. It could very well be that religion is brainwashing and maybe the biggest conspiracy ever pulled off!

    6%  Voted for by tarnishedheart, blackday.
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  • many of you are confused SEARCH FIND FACTS

    there are so many facts, read the case for christ or the case for a creator by lee strobel they'll start you off on the basis of evidence and factual explanations. another thing is that the bible does not once contradict itself and is flawless. something that isnt flawless and contradictory on rights and wrongs with as many pages and chapters as the bible has Must be worth your time. so SIMPLY PUT religion isnt brain washing

    listen up if God does not exist where in life do you hold true meaning your hopes are in vain

    if god does exist life holds true meaning because it is for a greater cause and a new beginning a new life from gods grace your hopes are in eternal happiness

    Voted for by colins573.
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  • How?

    How can people belive in somthing so strongly without a shred of physical proof? I better no get ne comments on "You feel wind right? But you cant see it...." yes you can see wind on a molecular level you can see it. I just cant grasp the concept of believing in somthing with my life and wiling to kill for somthing so empty...

    Voted for by Dantejin.
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  • ....

    i dont think religion is brainwashing. people have thier ways to get by, i.e. sex, reading, writing, for some its religion. yes, it contains propaganda, but what doesn't? all propaganda isn't brainwashing, religion certainly isn't. people can beleive what they want, they can worship a brick if they wanted to (heh....quote from my friend). they can make up their own rules.

    Voted for by emu girl.
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  • simply put

    it is brain washing

    Voted for by cerokhol.
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  • It's All Faith

    It reminds me of "Forgiven" by Alanis Morisette. In one of the chorus' it says: "we all needed something to believe in, so we did".

    I think everything comes back to what you believe. I, personally, don't want to believe in anything if that's what people are going to classify us in. Seriously, why believe if you don't have to. None of it makes sense. It's all faith.

    Voted for by Throwing The Rocks.
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  • Religion is dangerous

    FOr many reasons.. go read..

    Voted for by IiYiIiIzage.
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  • Brainwashing or Programming?

    We are all born with "Tabla Raza" (a clean slate). If our parents are religious and belong to a church or other house of worship, they usually inculcate their children with their religion, they program them. Like most of the other things we learn, we accept them without question and believe them to be true. Sometimes, for whatever reason, some of us question some of the things we have been taught. Sometimes this questioning leads to changes in our beliefs. To me, a former Roman Catholic, now 65 years old, the whole idea of religiousity and spirituality seems prepostrous.

    Voted for by Michael Dennis Rivers.
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