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Patriotism in America

  • Patriotism

    I was reading a book called "100 People Who Are Screwing up America (and Al Frankin is number 37)" by Bernard Goldberg

    And I came upon the name Barbara Kingsolver (I for get what number she was) and what she said in light of the 911 attacks.

    I have looked it up and am including parts of what she said for you followed by the link if you so wish to see it.

    ("MY DAUGHTER came home from kindergarten and announced, "Tomorrow we all have to wear red, white and blue."

    "Why?" I asked, trying not to sound wary.

    "For all the people that died when the airplanes hit the buildings."

    I fear the sound of saber-rattling, dread that not just my taxes but even my children are being dragged to the cause of death in the wake of death. I asked quietly, "Why not wear black, then? Why the colors of the flag, what does that mean?"

    "It means we're a country. Just all people together."

    So we sent her to school in red, white and blue, because it felt to her like something she could do to help people who are hurting. And because my wise husband put a hand on my arm and said, "You can't let hateful people steal the flag from us."

    He didn't mean terrorists, he meant Americans. Like the man in a city near us who went on a rampage crying "I'm an American" as he shot at foreign-born neighbors, killing a gentle Sikh man in a turban and terrifying every brown- skinned person I know. Or the talk-radio hosts, who are viciously bullying a handful of members of Congress for airing sensible skepticism at a time when the White House was announcing preposterous things in apparent self-interest, such as the "revelation" that terrorists had aimed to hunt down Air Force One with a hijacked commercial plane. Rep. Barbara Lee cast the House's only vote against handing over virtually unlimited war powers to one man that a whole lot of us didn't vote for. As a consequence, so many red-blooded Americans have now threatened to kill her, she has to have additional bodyguards.

    Patriotism seems to be falling to whoever claims it loudest, and we're left struggling to find a definition in a clamor of reaction. This is what I'm hearing: Patriotism opposes the lone representative of democracy who was brave enough to vote her conscience instead of following an angry mob. (Several others have confessed they wanted to vote the same way, but chickened out.) Patriotism threatens free speech with death. It is infuriated by thoughtful hesitation, constructive criticism of our leaders and pleas for peace. It despises people of foreign birth who've spent years learning our culture and contributing their talents to our economy. It has specifically blamed homosexuals, feminists and the American Civil Liberties Union. In other words, the American flag stands for intimidation, censorship, violence, bigotry, sexism, homophobia, and shoving the Constitution through a paper shredder? Who are we calling terrorists here? Outsiders can destroy airplanes and buildings, but it is only we, the people, who have the power to demolish our own ideals.

    It's a fact of our culture that the loudest mouths get the most airplay, and the loudmouths are saying now that in times of crisis it is treasonous to question our leaders. Nonsense. That kind of thinking let fascism grow out of the international depression of the 1930s. In critical times, our leaders need most to be influenced by the moderating force of dissent. That is the basis of democracy, in sickness and in health, and especially when national choices are difficult, and bear grave consequences.

    It occurs to me that my patriotic duty is to recapture my flag from the men now waving it in the name of jingoism and censorship. This isn't easy for me.

    The last time I looked at a flag with unambiguous pride, I was 13. Right after that, Vietnam began teaching me lessons in ambiguity, and the lessons have kept coming. I've learned of things my government has done to the world that made me direly ashamed. I've been further alienated from my flag by people who waved it at me declaring I should love it or leave it. I search my soul and find I cannot love killing for any reason. When I look at the flag, I see it illuminated by the rocket's red glare.

    This is why the warmongers so easily gain the upper hand in the patriot game: Our nation was established with a fight for independence, so our iconography grew out of war. Our national anthem celebrates it; our language of patriotism is inseparable from a battle cry. Our every military campaign is still launched with phrases about men dying for the freedoms we hold dear, even when this is impossible to square with reality. In the Persian Gulf War we rushed to the aid of Kuwait, a monarchy in which women enjoyed approximately the same rights as a 19th century American slave. The values we fought for and won there are best understood, I think, by oil companies. Meanwhile, a country of civilians was devastated, and remains destroyed.

    Stating these realities does not violate the principles of liberty, equality, and freedom of speech; it exercises them, and by exercise we grow stronger. I would like to stand up for my flag and wave it over a few things I believe in, including but not limited to the protection of dissenting points of view. After 225 years, I vote to retire the rocket's red glare and the bullet wound as obsolete symbols of Old Glory. We desperately need a new iconography of patriotism. I propose we rip stripes of cloth from the uniforms of public servants who rescued the injured and panic-stricken, remaining at their post until it fell down on them. The red glare of candles held in vigils everywhere as peace-loving people pray for the bereaved, and plead for compassion and restraint. The blood donated to the Red Cross. The stars of film and theater and music who are using their influence to raise money for recovery. The small hands of schoolchildren collecting pennies, toothpaste, teddy bears, anything they think might help the kids who've lost their moms and dads.

    My town, Tucson, Ariz., has become famous for a simple gesture in which some 8,000 people wearing red, white or blue T-shirts assembled themselves in the shape of a flag on a baseball field and had their photograph taken from above. That picture has begun to turn up everywhere, but we saw it first on our newspaper's front page. Our family stood in silence for a minute looking at that photo of a human flag, trying to know what to make of it. Then my teenage daughter, who has a quick mind for numbers and a sensitive heart, did an interesting thing. She laid her hand over a quarter of the picture, leaving visible more or less 6,000 people, and said, "That many are dead." We stared at what that looked like -- all those innocent souls, multi-colored and packed into a conjoined destiny -- and shuddered at the one simple truth behind all the noise, which is that so many beloved people have suddenly gone from us. That is my flag, and that's what it means: We're all just people together.")

    Link: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2001/09/25/ED34658.DTL

    Warious: Her name stood out to me because I am a library page, love to read, love books and love to know which authors wrote what. Barbara Kingsolver is the author of nine books including 'The Poisonwood Bible', 'Animal Dreams' and 'Pigs in Heaven.'

    After reading this and hearing several other people having said similar things about Patriotism I decided to throw in my two cents via blog which I now rewrite for you here on Allphilosophy.

    Patriotism is loyalty to the country one is a citizen of.

    If you were born here (America or elsewhere) or granted citizenship you are a citizen of that country. You owe (yes you do, you owe it because it protects you from other countries) the country YOUR loyalty.

    Now I know this is a hard concept for some of you Americans to grasp but really.

    Loyal is defined as: 1. Steadfast in allegiance to one's homeland, government, or sovereign. 2. Faithful to a person, ideal, custom, cause, or duty. 3. Of, relating to, or marked by loyalty. See Synonyms at faithful.

    Duty is defined as: 1 An act or a course of action that is required of one by position, social custom, law, or religion: Do your duty to your country.

    2. Moral obligation: acting out of duty.
3. The compulsion felt to meet such obligation.

    Patriotism is defined as: Love of and devotion to one's country. (dictionary.com)

    Loyalty (devotion), Love and Duty are part of patriotism.

    It is not as Mrs. Kingsolver says, "Patriotism opposes the lone representative of democracy who was brave enough to vote her conscience instead of following an angry mob."

    It does not "threatens free speech with death. It is infuriated by thoughtful hesitation, constructive criticism of our leaders and pleas for peace. It despises people of foreign birth who've spent years learning our culture and contributing their talents to our economy. It has specifically blamed homosexuals, feminists and the American Civil Liberties Union."

    Patriotism has abso-bloody-lutely nothing to do with what several liberal Americans believe.

    Patriotism is when one loves their country enough to fight for it and its right to survive. America is founded on Patriotism. If you learned any American history in school you would know that.

    If not for Patriotism you wouldn't have America. You wouldn't have all the stuff you have. You wouldn't have TV. You wouldn't have Nintendo. (Yes it's a Japanese company but America is partnered with it) You wouldn't have Ford trucks. If you think about it you wouldn't have much of anything if America wasn't a country.

    Yes America is guilty of unspeakable crimes in its past.

    Yes America isn't perfect.

    But there is no other country in the world that would tolerate the variety of opinions and beliefs there are in America. (Yet no one wants to tolerate Christians...I see hypocrisy in the cry for equal rights.)

    America has given equal right to females, blacks, natives, and many other little people groups.

    So what is your problem if, when attacked, people want to rise up in defense of their country?

    Why are there so many people out there that refuse to see this?

    Can't see the forest through the trees?

    Most likely.

    "the American flag stands for intimidation, censorship, violence, bigotry, sexism, homophobia, and shoving the Constitution through a paper shredder? Who are we calling terrorists here?"

    Well Ms Kingsolver, The American Flag doesn't stand for those things. If you were a real American you would never have said such a thing.

    If the constitution was 'Shoved through a shredder' we would have anarchy and chaos. (Personally I think that would be good for me because then I could initiate my plan for world domination...or at least installing an Emperor)

    We are calling those who threaten our county without declaring war as terrorists.

    Terrorists fight with no honor, nor do they have a particular country to which they belong or claim allegiance. And even if they did claim allegiance to a particular country that country (providing they were not terrorist supportive) would immediately disown them or punish them once caught.

    Redesigning our flag would be dishonoring the founding fathers original vision for this country. Changing age old symbolism would cause other to forget the past but not forgive.

    Now that I've got all that out of the way let me state my position.

    I am an Imperialist. I believe in an Empire. A single Dictator. A dictator that is forced into a position of power that he does not want but does his absolute best for the people he rules.

    However this is nearly impossible with humans. 1) They all make mistakes 2) Most become swayed by their own vices.

    I don't care what you people think of me, what I say, or who I do/don't agree with.

    You can flame me for it, you can ignore it or you can agree. It really doesn't matter.

    Feel free to disagree. America gave you that right.

    71%  Voted for by GoblinQueen Warious, DryIce808, prettygirl86j, Sokarjo, Mairi-Alannah.
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  • La raison tonne en sa cratere, c'est l'eruption de la fin.

    What _could_ imperialistic authoritarianism possibly have to say about honor? Its very foodstuff is predation and arbitrary, monomaniacal, pseudo-Hobbesian exploitation.

    She does not mean patriotism in your sense, I will admit. She is thinking of perhaps a lone woman who believes in democracy and wants to consider herself a patriot. This person wants to associate herself with patriotic people. All she finds, though, are those people who call themselves patriotic, and wave the flag in the manner that a crusader is granted absolution. This person felt as though she was promised what she thought was liberty, and wished to band together with people who thought they understood and continue to understand patriotism.

    To those credoes outside this vein, what is the difference between Clausewitz and Arafat? There is none. Sun Tzu understood, most notably by Mao, tells us that "terror" as we take it to be meant is a necessary element in war.

    The difference between terrorism and imperialism is negligible.

    I think that your view is not as a rational thinker, who understands that with the grandeur of global economy, politics, and social structures, that dictatorship simply doesn't work. What we have instead is a Platonic Oligarchy, though of the bourgeoisie rather than of useless philosophers. Speer, the Architect of the Third Reich War Effort believed that the Germans lost the war, not because of the freedom they denied themselves, but because economic centralization left the Nazis poorer than the British and American economies.

    "So what is your problem if, when attacked, people want to rise up in defense of their country?" The problem is that when human individuals rise up in defense, against something they can do nothing about like terrorism, it manifests itself in this same centralization. A state that focuses on the sake of militarism is far feebler than a militarism that exists subordinate to a state. Political action is the place for innovation and adaptation, and military strategy can only progress along established lines and unquestionably loyalty. Political action expresses the genius, however minute, of the people. Military action expresses the alleged genius of commanders, and suppresses more modern ideas of the people, who, on the battlefield, have never historically been better off knowing what's happening on other battlefields of the theater. Nous ne sommes rien, mais soyons tout.

    What you seem to want is a tribal chieftain to don his masks and reflect your understanding of the chaos of the planet earth through his own irrationality and irresistibly inadequate power. I say this, frankly, coz yer askin 4 it.

    I am glad that I can disagree. Thank you. I am glad that I can disagree in this great country. Although, I am afraid that my ability to disagree is threatened by the aberrations of patriotism that Mrs. Kingsolver finds.

    By the way, "redesigning our flag" has happened 32 times, ever since it only had thirteen stars.

    Voted for by Auxiliar.
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  • The Truth

    The raw truth is that if it weren't for partiotism and religeon, this world would be completely peaceful.

    Voted for by Icedflamez112.
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