There are 3 choices, 3 votes for Keegan A Combes' debate

When was the start of all religions, and beliefs?

I was thinking, When all these beliefs were started.

• HERE IT IS! I don't know how it is.

  But this is what I think.

  I’ll start here, with the spirituality, from aboriginals. First we are born, and then we die, we see a light, we come back, into a body, and say we just wanted to start over again. Now buddhists, reincarnation. We are born, then we die, karma travels to another body, and are born again, and in a few years, the baby recognizes somebody, and says out there name, or something. Christian, Catholic, and all those other religions like that, We are born, and we die, we see the light to heaven, some may see the path to hell, someone, is born again, and in a few years, just a little toddler, and he/she says, “God has sent me back, to help others” or something like that. And another spirit, is born again, and in a few years, just another little toddler, and he/she says, “I’ve seen the devil, he is giving me a second chance.”

  Voted for by Keegan A Combes.

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  • Waverider
    February 27, 2005
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    Big Al's Chef

    It all started with big Al. He was really good at language, so he decided to tell everyone what to do. When they were pissed off with what Big Al was telling them to do ( sleep with him, make him cheap wine, and make his bed) Big Al told them they were all going to be blessed for their hard work...similarly he told them that they would live forever, so even if they are unhappy making his wine, sleeping with him, making his 4 poster bed up, they could be content with living for eternal bliss
  • Waverider
    February 27, 2005
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    Big Al

    Although he had malcontents and general ugly sceptics...he tried to kill them off, but the more he killed the more anger grew. So one day while visiting one of his many palaces he notices a poor person at the side of the road. "Hey Buddy!" Big Al screamed, " Come over here and clean my shoes!" But the poor person shouted " Fuck your momma!" and he threw a wine bottle at Al's Limo, smashing the drivers window. So Al went home and decided he needed a new catchy phase to get his people on-side because their labour was not going as hard as he wanted it to go. He decided on " He works in mysterious ways." was going to be the nut. Nobody could question him now. If he needed to solve a problem he would recline in his leather suit, smoking a fat cigar, and point to his huge logo above the factory.
  • Keegan A Combes
    March 1, 2005
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    You have nothing.
  • • Waverider
      March 12, 2005
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      Big Al has more than you buddy.
    • • Keegan A Combes
        March 16, 2005
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        I don't know Big Al, and I can tell you, he isn't God.
      • • Keegan A Combes
          March 16, 2005
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          Wait a minute, did I read it right... oh well
  • ExistentialTheist
    March 16, 2005
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    Simply not based on historical fact

    Keegan I have read a number of you opinions on here, and I must request something of you: Back opinions up with logical reasoning or historical evidence or else your opinion is nothing more. What you have put forth here, Im afraid, is not good history. The religion that you describe as "starting with the aboriginals" is not what the earliest documented religions where like. Im not sure where you get this idea from, for historical fact flatly contradicts it.
  • • Keegan A Combes
      March 16, 2005
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      It is to obvious, that spirituality, started more than hundreds of thousands of years ago.
  • ExistentialTheist
    March 18, 2005
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    History..sources?

    Unless you are a history professor at a university, Keegan, please tell me precise evidence for what you posit.
  • Keegan A Combes
    March 18, 2005
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    Which is it, post or posit? Was that a typo, or did you mean, 'posit'?
  • ExistentialTheist
    March 19, 2005
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    i meant posit
  • Keegan A Combes
    March 19, 2005
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    I sometimes get confused with those two words. We used can hear the animals talk, thousands of years ago. And that is all I know. So, what do you think. I don't want to bother anybody anymore, so why don't you salute. And we can get this argument straight. Okay good bye
  • Darkness
    March 20, 2005
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    Be SERIOUS!!!!!!!!!!

    I don't think religion started with or out of spirituality as more out of greed and spitefulness. Before that, what we now label religious practices were simple little community customs, rituals, and routines that they had become use to and familiar with over generations. It did not become religion until greed began to play a part in it. Religion started the day man forgot how to live.
  • • Waverider
      March 22, 2005
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      Big Al is not god you are correct. Life started with spirituality? I can't see your reasoning here, and find nothing in yours arguments to even think it might be true. Life started off quite tough- and it still is- and it was those who were at the top who passified those at the bottom with religion. You will find it all over Africa even today...the Azande, the Kawelka, they all have their "Witch doctors" who control and have certain powers. Look at our witch doctors- look at the powers and comforts those supposed holy men have. Balls
    • malovent
      May 4, 2005
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      oh damn!

      religion started the day man forgot how to live.....i guess there are people in the world who know what they're talking about...right on!
    • redbrita
      May 27, 2005
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      YEAH!

      YEAH! also i think it started when men tried to explain things they didnt understand, which gave individuals power.
  • ExistentialTheist
    March 23, 2005
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    Probably not a good idea to argue with Keegan, Waverider, for you wont get far. Using modern African tribes as models for the first religious settlements is as fallacious as using chimpanzees as models for our evolutionary ancestors, for in these cases both the African tribes and chimpanzees have had as much time to evolve in way or another as Western civilization has, and it is therefore only through the same blind faith that you purport to abhor that you could possibly even be able to connect the "old with the new." I agree that life started off quite tough, but history, as in early Uruk, shows a reciprocity steeped in ritual that precedes the pacification that you speak of. Im afraid that such claims as "religion started the day man forgot how to live" do us no good-- please explain such ambiguous and bold claims. Certainly economies in Mesopotamia especially became more and more temple-based, but where do you get this criteria of when it becomes religion, and if you could please lay this criteria out for us all. Lastly, as I dont really have time to lay out a lengthy response to the last two, as you seem to be a student of philosophy from the nature of a couple of your posts, you should know better than to commit such genetic fallacies as criticizing a philosophy based on one's reasons for turning to it, be it hope, fear, comfort or other.
  • slender spider
    March 26, 2005
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    Waverider has a point

    Actually, I think Waverider has a point. He may have simplified his point of view in a simple story, but what are myths if not big stories of history whittled down to repetitive oral traditions, later to be written down on clay, leather or stone? Besides, allegory IS the language of religion, look at Aesops fables, of Christs parables, at the odes of Solomon.
  • slender spider
    March 26, 2005
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    The start of it all

    The source of our beliefs and stories, religious or mythical is simple; the human mind. I'm NOT saying we created god in our image, thats been debated elsewhere, I am saying that as the story goes, God created Adam(man-kind), and asked Adam to name all the animals, fish and foul, and Adam was the only one who could, and did name all the beasts. This is arguably a metaphor, of the relationship between God, Man and the World. The human mind, people, is the tool by which the Divine interacts, it is up to us, being the only recognised sentient life form on the planet to decipher so-called Gods will as we know it deep in our spiritual hearts. Some people's idea's were accepted over other people's, wars broke out, blood flowed, all over interpretations. The best we can hope for in this world is to glimpse (spiritual) reality from time to time, and spend our lives interpreting what we see. Ever notice nearly all the succesful religions say the same things? Be kind and generous, protect the weak, love your enemy, don't covet what your neighbour has etc etc. These are the spiritual truths that are important to a functioning and healthy community, do we really need priests and guru's to tell us this? We already know it deep in our center, what we need most is to find the courage to stick to our convictions, even if they differ from other points of view. Diversity, or variety, is the spice of life, who knows what insights and truths are to be learned when we hold our individual beliefs up for scrutiny by strangers?
  • • Waverider
      April 4, 2005
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      Respect Booyashaka! Firstly... i don't think i am being fallacious in pointing to African tribes/societies in illustrating the power/use/reasoning of religion...or behind religion. It would be too convoluted for me to go into on this page ( i can't remember all the facts) but i will say that those who have the "magic" have the power...and this links me onto what Slender S. was saying very effectively: the Human Mind created religion. I like what you said about myths, allegories etc., being the aspect of the human mind. The divine does work through the mind i think, but it is amazing how so many people misinterpret this. Do we express the divine with the language we use? Or is that just B.S ?
  • ExistentialTheist
    April 6, 2005
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    Spider- waverider presented a model that suggested how religion originated. In no way is it plausible to disagree that religion in its early days was used to exploit the weak or defend one's self... the corollary that I disagree with is that this is how all religion started. As for using African tribes/societies of today... certainly it is not fallacious to use them in studying religion in general...but you ARE making a huge leap of faith in asserting that the African societies of today are very good models for those that first practiced religion. The form of allegory itself is certainly is not fallacious in itself. I never suggested that in any way. The allegory, however, was a historical argument. I merely sought to point out that while this model is POSSIBLE for the beginning of a CERTAIN religion in some societies, its existence as the necessary explanation for established religion is not well established. I think it is an important distinction, and thus I sought to make it.
  • Keegan A Combes
    May 4, 2005
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    Hey I got to learn to write wit out t e hhhhhhhhh.
  • Keegan A Combes
    May 8, 2005
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    Hey, wait a minute. I just have created a new "Religion" as you guys call it. It is the, "_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _". And I have already written some of it. I was going to put in it, that you have to be a Shaman to follow it. But now I thought, that maybe anybody can join. And you have to respect every religion.

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